PRICE GOUGING BEGINS AT WALMART

[Adam Campbell]

I picked up a 7,000 watt generator a couple days ago as there were plenty on Craigslist.

I went to Walmart yesterday for another food run. The food shelves are 2/3 empty. They have GUARDS and a GATE SYSTEM in place for the toilet paper aisle and they WILL refuse to let you buy more than one pack, even if you try to buy a pack of Charmin and then go over to the camping section and pick up camping TP.

However I am ditching Walmart now after seeing them charging over $50 for a 2 GALLON GASOLINE CAN. The standard crappy PLASTIC ones.

You know we are f-d when Walmart is price gouging.

Home Depot in that town was shut down but the Lowe's across the street was still open.

I was able to pick up 3 FIVE GALLON gas cans (the same type) for the regular price of $20 each.

This is a warning to anyone who hasn't stocked up on gas yet. The second THAT panic sets in gasoline will be GONE in less than an hour.

You had about 3 days to get toilet paper when that panic started.

Walmart wanted me to pay over $150 to be able to carry 6 GALLONS OF GAS.

You can get STEEL 5-gallon Nato Jerry cans that are NICE for $50 each on a normal day.

Now at least at MY local Walmart they want $50 for a cheap plastic lawn mower gas can.

Run out to the hardware store and grab them before they are gone! Get your fuel stabilizer.

I am betting the second they announce martial law the lines at gas stations will be 10 miles long.

[Chemsoldier]

I am betting the second they announce martial law the lines at gas stations will be 10 miles long.

What does martial law even mean?  The local government is still way more functional than building a military form.  You could surge the whole DoD into the nation and most citizens wouldnt see a soldier, not to mention that a tremendous amount of the force structure is neither trained for enforcing order AND have important functions in this disaster that dont involve standing at COSTCO with guns (moving supplies, treating the sick, fixing things, building things, etc).

So far the guard has stayed on Title 32 (state authority) because the states know what to do with them.  The NGB remembers that Cali was using the guard effectively during the LA riots and that when they were placed under Title 10 (federal) authority, the new federal military command pulled them off of useful work while the Title 10 commander and staff figured out what they could use them for.  Not to mention that under Title 32 there are no PCA considerations, under Title 10, PCA does apply.

Further question...if demand is increasing while supply is uncertain, why shouldn't prices go up?  Even if it is greed on Wal-Mart's part, it also fullfilled the market's purposes.  It discouraged you from buying the product (you apparently care more about the savings than the cans) so someone who isnt a prepper and really freaking needs it (or thinks they do) can have it.  The profit they make off that product when it sells sends signals to the gas can manufacturer to make more cans, and the profit potential will signal people with gas cans and little need for them to put them on ebay and such....increasing supply even without making more cans.

[Morning Sunshine]

Further question...if demand is increasing while supply is uncertain, why shouldn't prices go up?  Even if it is greed on Wal-Mart's part, it also fullfilled the market's purposes.

also - it might not be WAL-MART who raised the price.  It might be their SUPPLIER who is raising the prices, or the SHIPPING companies.  There is a shortage, and that means that the price increases through the line...

[Carver]

If the government tries to deal with so-called price gouging with price controls the marketplace will counter by renaming old products; rib-eye steak will be renamed eye-of-rib. Toilet paper will be renamed NY Post, and so on.

[ChEng]

...Further question...if demand is increasing while supply is uncertain, why shouldn't prices go up?  Even if it is greed on Wal-Mart's part, it also fullfilled the market's purposes.  It discouraged you from buying the product (you apparently care more about the savings than the cans) so someone who isnt a prepper and really freaking needs it (or thinks they do) can have it.  The profit they make off that product when it sells sends signals to the gas can manufacturer to make more cans, and the profit potential will signal people with gas cans and little need for them to put them on ebay and such....increasing supply even without making more cans.

Chem, It's really great to see that not everyone mis-understands capitalism. The market is the best determiner of price, and any outside interference (government trying to regulate price/supply, or trying to stop "gouging") will only make things worse.

[IKN]

Problem is that what's happening isn't Capitalism.
If it was, gasoline should be <$1.00 per gallon given the greatly reduced demand from lock downs and stay at home quarantines.
There's also the plummeting Gold & Silver prices. Given the state of the markets, both should be soaring through the roof right now.
The line about paper ETF for gold & silver being sold is driving down the price is garbage. If it were truly a capitalistic supply and demand, prices would sky rocket since the demand is high and supply is zero.
Maybe I should list my silver on eBay for $800 an ounce, see if anyone jumps on it or see if I get arrested for price gouging.

[iam4liberty]

If it was, gasoline should be <$1.00 per gallon given the greatly reduced demand from lock downs and stay at home quarantines.

Well, to tell the truth it isnt too far off that now. Price is dropping quickly as lower priced gasoline makes its way through system.  Just bought today at $1.24.  Haven't seen that level in about 17 years.

There's also the plummeting Gold & Silver prices. Given the state of the markets, both should be soaring through the roof right now.

Price = Spot + Premium.  Currently for silver that is about $13 + $10 = $23.  Before this started it was about $18+$1 =$19.  That is about a 20% rise. So it isnt a matter of silver dropping overall, but a matter of who is getting what portion of the pie. Could it go higher, sure.  But right now everyone is trying to build up cash because of fear of a multi-month lockdown. 

[cmxterra]

Supply and demand.. There is no price gouge.

Less supply  = Higher price. Simple economics.

There was plenty of supply before this and if you waited till now then yes.. you will pay more because it is a scarce item.  I swear.

[Carver]

#1) I have one marble and one hundred buyers.
#2) I have one hundred marbles and one buyer.
Is one marble in scenario #2 going to sell at the same price as the marble in scenario #1?

[ChEng]

#1) I have one marble and one hundred buyers.
#2) I have one hundred marbles and one buyer.
Is one marble in scenario #2 going to sell at the same price as the marble in scenario #1?

Exactly! A good (although exaggerated for illustration) example of supply and demand. And, if #1 occurs because of some disaster that wipes out marbles, that does not change the "right-ness" of the pricing. ANY attempt to artificially force change the price is wrong, and will cause damage to trade.

[IKN]

Price = Spot + Premium.  Currently for silver that is about $13 + $10 = $23.  Before this started it was about $18+$1 =$19.  That is about a 20% rise. So it isnt a matter of silver dropping overall, but a matter of who is getting what portion of the pie. Could it go higher, sure.  But right now everyone is trying to build up cash because of fear of a multi-month lockdown.

If your scenario is true and everyone is selling their silver & gold to liquidate for cash, there should be a glut of physical gold & silver available to buy at cheap prices.
Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place, please add links to where they are available to buy and deliver.

Truth is that the only gold & silver being sold is the fake paper ETC's, not the physical metals.
Tens of thousands of people are wanting to buy the physical metals, but none are available to purchase.

Big demand, little to no supply, and price is in the toilet.
Doesn't seem to fit the marble equation.

[LvsChant]

also - it might not be WAL-MART who raised the price.  It might be their SUPPLIER who is raising the prices, or the SHIPPING companies.  There is a shortage, and that means that the price increases through the line...

Thank you, MS, Chem et al. Letting the free market set prices and not keeping them artificially low in times of increased demand and reduced supply ensures that people only buy what they really need and keeps supply available!!!

I totally do not agree that price controls are a good thing (or shaming businesses who pass along increased costs when setting prices).

@Adam: You did what every rational buyer would do... bypass the higher priced item, tried to see if you could find them for less elsewhere... found it at a lesser price elsewhere. This is the market working.

Once the stock at HD is gone, they may also be forced to raise their prices when they restock if shortages and increased shipping costs exist... eventually the prices will normalize and real demand will be met, assuming supplied don't completely dry up through normal channels. When that happens, entrepreneurs who have bought more than they need will sell their excess supply at a premium...

[Chemsoldier]

If your scenario is true and everyone is selling their silver & gold to liquidate for cash, there should be a glut of physical gold & silver available to buy at cheap prices.
Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place, please add links to where they are available to buy and deliver.

Truth is that the only gold & silver being sold is the fake paper ETC's, not the physical metals.
Tens of thousands of people are wanting to buy the physical metals, but none are available to purchase.

Big demand, little to no supply, and price is in the toilet.
Doesn't seem to fit the marble equation.

I would assume the supply dries up because people are buying it up...however, with a general large market decline...confidence is not shot on the normal things (just stocks that are seen as risky)...confidence is shot on things that don't keep you alive and safe right now.  We are used to gold and silver being a hedge in a bear market.  But this is not a normal bear market, this is a bear market where even big wigs are fearing for their physical safety and security (maslow definition).  Prepper/doomer/rich types who are set enough to be thinking ahead are probably more than sufficient to buy all the physical metal up.  Despite the supply drying up, ya can't eat it...the price continues to decline. Which means it will be snapped up by silver and gold focused people even faster. *shrug*  Seems a likely enough scenario I don't feel like obsessing about it.  I also dont think mining the stuff is going to scale very well.  So I doubt we will see the supply increase significantly anytime soon till the price rebounds enough for people to start selling what they have.

 Much (not all) of my precious metals were purchased at higher prices than this, and those that keep physical metals rarely have no other form of liquid savings...so why should they be selling physical metal yet?  They will hold onto it till it does what they bought it for...become more valuable in the circumstances.

[iam4liberty]

If your scenario is true and everyone is selling their silver & gold to liquidate for cash, there should be a glut of physical gold & silver available to buy at cheap prices.
Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place, please add links to where they are available to buy and deliver.

Truth is that the only gold & silver being sold is the fake paper ETC's, not the physical metals.
Tens of thousands of people are wanting to buy the physical metals, but none are available to purchase.

Big demand, little to no supply, and price is in the toilet.
Doesn't seem to fit the marble equation.

The paper silver and gold is oversold because of margin calls.  They dont want to liquidate these assets but they are being forced to do so.  That is the danger of buying on margin. 

Again, the price of delivered precious metals is up substantially.  You can not buy silver or gold at spot price.  It is like saying you can buy a loaf of bread at the price of grain from the farmer.  Grain is not bread. The delivered, manufactured precious metal price is always higher than spot.  Demand is driving it through the roof.  That is what the premium is reflecting.  And yes, you can buy the large (1000 ounce for silver) bars held in the market exchange warehouses and take delivery of them (spot price + delivery cost) but it will be months before you will get it and you will halve to then mint it into smaller quantities.  Then when you try to sell you will need to spend a lot on marketing to convince prospective buyers that your bars/rounds are legit.

Apmex and other large distributors have been doing that and selling preorders for as low as $19 an ounce.  But even those are now being sold out because the mints dont have capacity to process them in time for later delivery.  Meanwhile, the price to mine precious metals is dropping because of the drop in fuel price.

Again these are different markets.  The retail price (to get it in your hands today) have much higher premiums on many products than wholesale, distrbutor, manufacturer, and ingredient prices.  If you want it today, you will have to pay the higher price premium the short term demand spike has created.  If you dont care about delivery, you can bargain hunt the depressed prices of the earlier stages taking on the additional risks.

[Stwood]

I've never seen gouging at Walmart. Hope that is not a coming thing.
I've seen some high prices on their website, but it's the third party sellers doing that, like Amazon's third party sellers.
I always ck the Walmart seller box when on the website, that way I don't have to filter through the higher prices.

I've been reporting some of the third party sellers on Amazon when I see something out of line, such as $14.00 for a can of spam......

[Redman]

I've been reporting some of the third party sellers on Amazon when I see something out of line, such as $14.00 for a can of spam......

I checked those hash browns I bought several weeks ago. Saw prices over $100 for box of 8 cartons. Don't know where the report'em thing is.

[Morning Sunshine]

I've been reporting some of the third party sellers on Amazon when I see something out of line, such as $14.00 for a can of spam......

The thing I am wondering - do these people even EAT spam?  I know some older folks do, but the spam was GONE from Costco.

[Stwood]

I checked those hash browns I bought several weeks ago. Saw prices over $100 for box of 8 cartons. Don't know where the report'em thing is.

In the description, look at >report incorrect product listing<.
Click on that, then first menu, click other.
Then second menu, click price.
Then state your purpose, bitching  in the box.

[Stwood]

The thing I am wondering - do these people even EAT spam?  I know some older folks do, but the spam was GONE from Costco.

I'm thinking probably no. Probably the last thing they will eat if they have to.

We've got back into eating it, as we need to rotate it. Takes some buying of different brands to find the ones you can eat.
We've settled on.....
Spam (Hormel)
Treet (Armour)
GV (Great Value)

As Red can attest, Bristol's Luncheon Loaf at the dollar tree......bleeeech.....
Warning...........contains rubber I think. 

[Redman]

As Red can attest, Bristol's Luncheon Loaf at the dollar tree......bleeeech.....
Warning...........contains rubber I think. 

From MASH bleeeech rubber oyster things (smoked oyster reference). Yes that stuff is nasty and I got 4 cans. me-><-me.

[Stwood]

I took 12 cans to the food bank. Hopefully someone there enjoyed it.

BTW, I heard ours has closed, a couple weeks ago due to lack of donations.

[Morning Sunshine]

I took 12 cans to the food bank. Hopefully someone there enjoyed it.

BTW, I heard ours has closed, a couple weeks ago due to lack of donations.

yeah - ours was saying that the biggest donation they get is scouting for food, but that was scheduled to happen right as the shut down started, so it was cancelled.  And then our church was going to organize one, but we were told not to do so.  Anyway, our FB is hurting pretty bad.  My neighbor decided he was just going to ask our road to donate and he would pick it up at the mailboxes tomorrow.

[Stwood]

yeah - ours was saying that the biggest donation they get is scouting for food, but that was scheduled to happen right as the shut down started, so it was cancelled.  And then our church was going to organize one, but we were told not to do so.  Anyway, our FB is hurting pretty bad.  My neighbor decided he was just going to ask our road to donate and he would pick it up at the mailboxes tomorrow.

I was thinking the other day...........Walmart here donates all their almost-out-of date food items. With Walmart being sold out and ran ragged, I highly doubt there is anything left for them to donate, as with our other small grocery in town.

[Morning Sunshine]

I was thinking the other day...........Walmart here donates all their almost-out-of date food items. With Walmart being sold out and ran ragged, I highly doubt there is anything left for them to donate, as with our other small grocery in town.

oh yeah - that is the other thing I forgot.  Their other big donations come from local grocery stores who have close-dated or excess items.  None of that happening now.

[Adam Campbell]

Hmmm I did buy some boxes of crackers and then saw that the date was TOMORROW... But they are sealed and I really don't care that much. We have lots of soup so they will get used up.

As for the gas cans, I wasn't really THAT angry. Maybe I should have laid off the CAPS LOCK hahaha.

All I was saying is watch out for these greedy bastards and make sure you have what you need before 5 gallons of gas costs you 1,000 rounds of ammo, 2 bottles of hand sanitizer, and a roll of toilet paper in our dystopian future!