Steel Water Bottle

[Josh the Aspie]

All,

So I lost one of my old steel water bottles, and the other is getting dinged up and moving from my EDC to some less visible gear caching.  So I'm selecting a new one.  I thought I could use a sanity check, and perhaps I've found some gear in my comparison shopping others would be interested in.

The last time I checked, I only found the wide mouth Kleen Kanteen (which is what my old bottle is).  My only real complaint on this bottle is that the silicon lid will want to slip and slide out of place if you get it hot at all, which makes the lid not dishwasher safe, and also means it's use as a boiling container is limited.

This time around I found several, and would like to get a different brand/model, to compare for myself if nothing else.

So far my top pick is the Nalgene.   2nd Link Originally I was getting a stainless steel bottle designed to be a replacement for the plastic nalgene, so getting one by these folks, to ensure that accessories for nalgene bottles would work with the cantine makes some sense.  But there's another reason as well.  It has a large lip on the bottle, below the threading, that can be used for easy suspension of the bottle over a fire for water purification or cooking, or can be used to lower the bottle into a water source with some cordage.


It comes in two sizes 32oz, and 38oz.  The 32oz would be reliably cleaned of viruses by a water purification tablet or packet.  The 38 oz would obviously get more volume.  Also, if I decide to add a cup to the bottle, it seems like it'd be easier to find one to fir the shape of the 38oz than the 32.  I know why people with plastic canteens get the cups (for boiling things in them, and being able to cook things in the cup), but I'm not sure how much use that'd be if you already have a bottle that's stainless steel.

The others I'm looking at are the Blackthorn, and the Pathfinder, which has some specifically paired accessories, such as cup, and stove rack.  I've also seen some pre-made bags for it in the past.

So, any potentially better bottles I may be missing?  Any experience with the above bottles, or advice on what to pick?

[bcksknr]

     Aldi's (a chain of low priced groceries and misc. merchandise) has a nice stainless widemouth 40oz. water bottle for $4.99. I put a suspension loop of stainless wire around the mouth of all my water bottles, to boil water over an open fire, The screw on lid is plastic with a gasket and a "keeper". Naturally, you'd take the lid off to boil. They come in silver, black or colors. Being wide mouth, you could cook a stew, clean it out easily and it is the right diameter to fit inside a (Walmart?) stainless cup.  You could also fill them with survival food or gear, if your not going to keep them full of water in your kit. I have a couple and I like them.

[Josh the Aspie]

Ah.

Do you know if standard water filters fit their threading?  That's one of my requirements for a new one.

[endurance]

While I don't own one, I've been eyeballing the pathfinder setup for a while.

If you're not familiar with survival resources, I'd suggest giving their options a look. Many are the same, but they also carry some small upgrades that can make a good product great. Just beware, the website is like crack. They carry so damn many useful products for backcountry utility that you'll end up bookmarking half the site for future reference.

[bcksknr]

     The opening is too big for any threaded filter to fit. I have a Sawyer mini filter in a kit and two Platypus brand collapsible 1 liter water bladders, that will mate with the filter's threads. I guess when it comes to filters there are two ways to go. Either you strain out the big chunks and put raw water into a water bag or bottle and then suck the water out through your filter. Or, with the Sawyer, you squeeze raw water from the filter's bag through the filter and store the potable water in another bladder or bottle. I worry a little about getting unfiltered water into the filtered stuff from drips on the outside of the setup. I also think there may be a way to fix up a gravity feed to do this. I guess I'd rather carry clean ready to drink water in my containers, rather than raw water.
     When we used to canoe the Boundary Waters, we used a Katadyn pump filter to fill containers. The pump type put out a nice stream with little danger of cross contamination. I still have two of them, one each in two kits, and the "straw" type devices are for backup.

[CombatPeds]

I have both the nalgene 32 oz stainless and the Kleen Canteen narros mouth. The steripen folks have a filter adapter that they sell SteriPEN FitsAll Filter it filters a lot of sediment and the the steripen kills the rest. 

[Carl]

     The opening is too big for any threaded filter to fit. I have a Sawyer mini filter in a kit and two Platypus brand collapsible 1 liter water bladders, that will mate with the filter's threads. I guess when it comes to filters there are two ways to go. Either you strain out the big chunks and put raw water into a water bag or bottle and then suck the water out through your filter. Or, with the Sawyer, you squeeze raw water from the filter's bag through the filter and store the potable water in another bladder or bottle. I worry a little about getting unfiltered water into the filtered stuff from drips on the outside of the setup. I also think there may be a way to fix up a gravity feed to do this. I guess I'd rather carry clean ready to drink water in my containers, rather than raw water.
     When we used to canoe the Boundary Waters, we used a Katadyn pump filter to fill containers. The pump type put out a nice stream with little danger of cross contamination. I still have two of them, one each in two kits, and the "straw" type devices are for backup.

A 2 liter cola bottle with the bottom cut off (like a funnel to pour into) will gravity feed the SAWYER and use a length of tubing to avoid drips by not collecting clean directly below the filter...also a sag-loop to keep external drips and condensation from following the tubing into the clean catchment container...the flow is pretty good while filter is fresh and about 3 feet drop between input and output.

[bcksknr]

Thanks Carl, for that tip. I found that my new SOL breathable bivy bag will fit nicely inside the 2 liter bottle (with the bottom of the bottle cut off, and a wire handle for hanging). One concern I have is "nesting" things inside of other things, to save space. Maybe in a smaller kit it wouldn't make sense to carry a gravity feed setup, but for a larger kit, that may hold supplies for a longer term "base camp", it would. I always have a coiled length of plastic tubing to suck water from inconvenient catchments. I also keep two compressed sponges, a blue one for soaking up water or dew and an orange one for hygiene.

[Carl]

Thanks Carl, for that tip. I found that my new SOL breathable bivy bag will fit nicely inside the 2 liter bottle (with the bottom of the bottle cut off, and a wire handle for hanging). One concern I have is "nesting" things inside of other things, to save space. Maybe in a smaller kit it wouldn't make sense to carry a gravity feed setup, but for a larger kit, that may hold supplies for a longer term "base camp", it would. I always have a coiled length of plastic tubing to suck water from inconvenient catchments. I also keep two compressed sponges, a blue one for soaking up water or dew and an orange one for hygiene.

Obviously you go,and do,far more than I do...but I still have a few cheap tricks...
like a few coffee filters to use as pre-filters in the 2 liter gravity feed  filter...
but even a bandanna will do to catch the 'chunks' and make the SAWYER work longer between flushings.
You can make a lot of things with the leavings of society and often find the stuff you need ...if in well traveled areas.

[bcksknr]

     Their is a new survival "reality" show called Alone. They started with ten guys and put them in different locations on Vancouver Island (no contact between the "contestants"). They were each allowed 10 items of their choice. The last one standing gets $500,000. Three days in and two have tapped out already. There is a sizable population of wolves, cougars and bears on the island. The first guy out found that he had set up his camp practically on top of a bear den with a sow and two cubs (he totally lost it). The second one out got spooked by howling wolves, he was crying. Anyway, the beach areas are a goldmine of washed up trash such as bottles, floats, etc. One guy found a nice round float about the size of a bowling ball. I'm waiting to see if he drills a hole in it with his knife to make a canteen. It seems as though a fresh water source is the critical thing right now. Second is fire and shelter because it never stops raining (Pacific Northwest coast) and 40 degree temps. The disclaimer at the beginning says these guys are all highly trained survival experts...not from what I've seen. On guy dropped his fero steel on the beach (no lanyard) and now he can't find it.

[Josh the Aspie]

Thanks for all of the info guys.

In particular, that page full of survival gear Endurance.  I could easily see myself spending a large amount of time browsing it.

Single-piece of metal titanium tweesers?  I might not put that on my keyring, but that sounds like a great thing to have in an every-day backpack, or a multi-day backpacking medkit.

Not sure if I'd keep it in a minimalist water-bottle bag kit though.

Still, curious as to why people have the metal cup to accompany an already metal cantine.

[bcksknr]

     Just a thought, Josh the Aspie. Ever since we were kids, we were taught to not eat out of the "cookpot". Food was prepared in one container and eaten out of another. How many times have you heard "don't drink out of the milk carton"? For hygiene reasons we don't lick the serving spoon. I think it's just a built in habit that we keep our portion separate from the communal cookpot.
     Also, I like to have a beverage with my meal and that means two containers. If your going to carry two containers they might as well have the usefulness of metal vs. plastic.

[Josh the Aspie]

An interesting assessment.

The main utility I can think of is when combining water and dryer substances together.  I might not want to have residue in my water bottle (that is harder to clean than a cup), over a longer-term trek.  Similarly, I may have a full water bottle, but want to cook some mac and cheese.  If it's mountain house, I can just do that in the bag... but if it's a store boxed one in a ziplock bag, I'd need to put it in a container that can withstand the heat of the hot water, and possibly receive extra heating.

Or, perhaps in the morning I have some clean water left after drinking my fill, and want to filter then boil some more, then let it cool, and have it sealed up by the time I get on the trail.  Given the time that takes, I may well want to drink what I have left of that clean water right before I leave camp for the day.

So I suppose  after mulling it over I have thought of some reasons to have a separate cup, that nests well with my cantine.

[endurance]

Metal bottles aren't my usual fare, since I'm generally an ultralight backpacker with target weights in the sub-12 pound range (except food, water and fuel). However, some kit needs to be more robust if you're assuming no chance to replace or properly repair gear. That's why I own steel bottles, but they aren't in my normal use rotation. Thus, my advice on which is best is limited. I have an older clean canteen and have been looking at a variety of different things, but might just stick with what I have.

For backpacking I have a titanium pot with lid and my stove is a fancy feast cat food can with 30 or so holes I put in it with a hole punch and I use everclear as a dual use fuel. One ounce will bring my pot to boil. Another ounce with A quart of KoolAid will bring a smile to my face. And some nights I just don't feel like cooking and it's a shame to let that fuel to to waste.

My pot is just for boiling water, not for cooking. My cooking is all inside a gallon ziplock bag or snack-sized ziplock. They'll handle boiling water just fine and all the mess stays inside, so I don't have to clean anything except my spoon at the end of dinner. The best meals for this are Ramen, angel hair pastas, and mashed potatoes (the ones that are preseasoned with garlic rock!). I buy number 10 cans of freeze dried ground beef and fill snack sized ziplocks with it. Add boiling water five minutes before rehydrating your pasta or taters and they'll be ready at the same time. If you have a bubble wrap padded shipping envelope, that's the best container on earth for putting your ziplocks in once you add the boiling water. Great insulator and weighs and cost next to nothing. I made one out of reflective bubble wrap but I can't say it was worth the extra effort.

Soy sauce packets and seasoning packets from Taco Bell and Chinese restaurants are great for the trail, too.