winter backpacking

[nimzy88]

Ok so it is Hudson Bay Bread, there are many variations, but it is a great high calorie bread to keep in your pocket as you are hiking through the winterwonderland. Just remember to keep it in a pocket inside your jacket or it may be hard as a rock when you try to take a bite

Here is a link to a recipe. I don't remember if this is the exact one we used but its close.
http://www.boyscouttrail.com/content/recipe/recipe-1380.asp

[caldweller79]

Last time I backpacked in the winter I learned a lesson about boot preparation.  I had a nice pair of gor-tex boots.  However, that didn't stop the outside of the boot from getting wet.  No big deal, until the next morning.  The outside of the boot was frozen solid.  The inside was still dry, but I couldn't get my foot into the boot because it was a solid block of ice.  Since then I spray my boots with a water repelling spray (silicon) before I camp in the winter.  It keeps them much dryer and warmer and I can get them on the next morning.

[Asclepius]

I have great luck with smartwool and icebreaker baselayers. It is below freezing here and was -16 f the other day. The merino wool baselayers keep you comfortably warm and dry. They also don't stink or itch like other materals.

[CountryRootsCityJob]

I have great luck with smartwool and icebreaker baselayers. It is below freezing here and was -16 f the other day. The merino wool baselayers keep you comfortably warm and dry. They also don't stink or itch like other materals.

On that note, I've found that Smartwool is much warmer than Icebreaker... and the price is better too (at my local shop).  I learned this after I had received an Icebreaker and purchased a smartwool shirt...

There's my 2 cents!

Oh, as for boots... make sure they aren't worn out before going on a trip   32 miles over Thanksgiving taught me that ;-)
~CRCJ

[ridge rover]

Tent or tarp? A heater of any type is great in a tent in the morning. Many options from candle types to alcohol stoves, etc. Just be aware of ventilation.


Heat Sheets have many uses from fire reflectors to reflectors in the "Super Shelter" mode. They are reuseable unlike the Space blankets.

[Lara]

There's a whole tent vs tarp discussion here:
http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=19882.0

Personally, I don't light any flame inside a tent ever.  Not only am I tying up perfectly good hemoglobin with carboxy- instead of oxy- (when I'm usually at high altitude, and could really use as much oxyhemoglobin as I can get), there's also the fact that even though they're flame retardant, tents can still burn.  I'd rather be a little cold, frankly, but to each their own.

[surfivor]

 winter back packing is tough because it's harder to go ultra light. I have an insulated mattress, but it was expensive and it's a bit bulky. My sides get cold kind of easy and it effects my sciatic nerve and causes pains in my back/lower sides. This can start to happen if I spend alot of time in the cold.

These are interesting topics for general survival in SHTF as well.

 I've spent alot of time winter camping, but mostly from a car or RV.


 A 3 pound wood stove for back packing ? Now I have seen everything.  So I figured out that it is a kifaru stove. Very cool, seems like great survival gear to think about getting for winter survival/camping. Never heard of a modular sleep system before either. Great gear ideas. I have different sleeping bags, nothing modular. I wounder what are some good modular systems out there ? That supertarp has a place for the stove pipe to pass through ? Almost makes me want to go winter backpacking or something that otherwise doesn't appeal to me a whole lot.
 



 Some interesting ideas here, got to admit ..

 I bought a bag rated to 20 below zero a couple of years ago ..

 

[Andy in NH]

I wounder what are some good modular systems out there ?

Kifaru Regulator System

That supertarp has a place for the stove pipe to pass through ?

My other picture didn't show the annex which has the stovepipe port.

[surfivor]

 hey Andy,

 Those pictures are both part of the super tarp ?

 I haven't been looking to spend alot more money, but with the economic situation and all I may take out an early withdrawal from my IRA.
Some of this kifaru stuff seems like a great survivalist investment here in the northeast and as good an investment as buying gold coins. I am wondering if I should buy some of this stuff and will probably be seriously thinking about it. Makes me feel like if I took off into the woods in mid winter, I'd have half a chance to not be totally miserable if I had a little portable woodstove .. I'm not sure how long a stove like that could really last or if you could patch it if holes burned into it, but I was amazed that stuff like this is out there ..

 I went on the kifaru site and saw how the pipes roll up which was another amazing thing ..

[Andy in NH]

Those pictures are both part of the super tarp ?

Yes, the annex is a separate piece so that you can use the tarp itself in more temperate weather.

I haven't been looking to spend alot more money.

One thing about Kifaru gear - it's pricey.  It is all made in America and they need to pay the workers an American wage.

I'm not sure how long a stove like that could really last or if you could patch it if holes burned into it, but I was amazed that stuff like this is out there ..

Another thing about Kifaru gear, re: the stoves - they are very well constructed.  They are made from stainless steel.  I've never seen or heard of a stove (or stove pipe) burning through.

[surfivor]

 how long is the stove pipe for the super tarp ? The website doesn't show that configuration that I saw ..

[Andy in NH]

how long is the stove pipe for the super tarp ? The website doesn't show that configuration that I saw ..

The Super-Tarp can use the para-stove or the small stove.  Both of these stoves come with a 48" stove pipe.  If you desire a longer pipe, you can order one.

[surfivor]

 The military uses these things ? Are you x-military ?

 Why doesn't the heat from the pipe harm the fabric ? There is no need for a spark arrestor ? Strong winds won't knock the stove pipe around or cause it to dislodge ? The fabric is made of some super strength stuff so you can use sticks for tent poles ?

 I have a portable folding wood stove from cabelas that weighs 40 pounds. I've used it with a fold up yurt from shelter systems. rigging a standard 5 inch stove pipe through one of the doors was quite a hack job using plywood and stuff used on screen doors. My set up is big and bulky and it would be hard for me to even go cold weather car camping in something like a toyota corolla with all that. The yurt itself is pretty huge to carry around. If I had known about this kifaru stuff, I probably would have bought from them years ago. I know have a more permanent 310 square foot yurt in maine with a wood stove, but I am super impressed with this kifaru equipment ..

[boboroshi]

I did a bunch of cold weather camping in the scouts and the real important stuff for me was long underwear. At the time it was polypro, now it's newer materials. I use the base layer stuff from Orvis and choose heavy or light depending on the task. I also wear really warm boots while out and about. For me, as long as my feet are warm, I'm in a pretty good mood. Feet get frozen? I'm done.

Alpaca wool sweaters can't be beat. thin but REALLY warm. And any time you have to sit, don't do it right on the ground, as it will suck the heat out of you. Get a camp chair or even a 2'x2' pad.

I also recommend carrying somethign to spit wood with, be it a small hand axe or larger camp axe. Worst case you can always construct shelter and make a fire. Not the ideal for "leave only footprints" but if you get into a survival situation, being able to make quick work of things is important.

The other important thing is to be careful of sweat. Balance your layers so that you aren't sweating profusely. When you stop, even with great base layers, etc. being wet = misery.

[Andy in NH]

The military uses these things ? Are you x-military ?

 Why doesn't the heat from the pipe harm the fabric ? There is no need for a spark arrestor ? Strong winds won't knock the stove pipe around or cause it to dislodge ? The fabric is made of some super strength stuff so you can use sticks for tent poles ?

The Super-Hooch is the military version of the Super-Tarp.  I'm not sure how widespread the use is in the military.  Kifaru has a military line of packs that has proven popular with individual military members.  I was told that Kifaru filled an order for the Canadian Military, but again, I'm not sure about how widespread the use is.

I'm a former Marine.

The stove jack is made from a fiberglass material which protects it from the heat. The remainder of the shelter is made from water proof hang glider fabric - very susceptible to heat damage.

There are two removable / adjustable spark screens in a collar located between the stove and the stove pipe.

Site selection will help mitigate the effects of wind on the tipis and stovepipes.  The literature on the Kifaru website mentions that the tipis / stove pipes have done well in winds over 50 mph.

The areas of the tarps that use sticks / trekking poles for support have a patch sewn in to reinforce those areas.

 

...I am super impressed with this kifaru equipment ..

Come see it at the Kifaru East Coast Rendezvous: http://www.kifaruforums.net/showthread.php?23812-ECR-11-dates...!

[surfivor]

 Andy,

 I wonder how hard it would be to build your own stove pipe similar to what kifaru makes ?

 I've found some web sites that describe making stoves, even small ones. Making your own portable stove pipe I'm less clear on.

 Since the kifaru stuff is expensive, it seems like a valuable exercise to consider how you could make your own equipment if that is feasible. In a societal melt down, it occurs to me that someone might try to steal my equipment. If that happened, I could be out of alot of valuable stuff I couldn't replace. I'm sure I could not make something quite as compact and portable as they do, but I do wonder what might be possible.

 Some of these little stoves seem like they could make overnight canoe trips in the spring more feasible as the nights may be cold ..

Here is something that seems similar to kifaru stoves:
http://www.titaniumgoat.com/stoves.html

This company also sells pipes separately, maybe that would be an option. I guess they are stainless steel or titanium. That being the case, I am not sure how the heat would not effect the tent fabric or if I am not getting the whole picture. I didn't see where kifaru might sell stove pipes separately.

http://www.titaniumgoat.com/pipe-parts.html

I guess what they have is something called a stove boot that you sew into your tent wall:


This is a home made stove:

[Andy in NH]

I wonder how hard it would be to build your own stove pipe similar to what kifaru makes ?

Not hard, you just have to find the stainless steel foil they use and cut it to size.  You would have to fabricate the stovepipe rings also.

I've found some web sites that describe making stoves, even small ones. Making your own portable stove pipe I'm less clear on.

There is a lot of info here on building small wood stoves.  They all seem to use the same stovepipe design: http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26369

In a societal melt down, it occurs to me that someone might try to steal my equipment.

In that case I'd suggest using a different option entirely.

I didn't see where kifaru might sell stove pipes separately.

They do - just call them and order one.

I guess what they have is something called a stove boot that you sew into your tent wall:

Kifaru's is very similar.

[joeinwv]

There are a lot of DIY stoves for camping out there - I have seen them made from empty Coleman fuel cans, 50 cal ammo can, propane / freon tanks, etc.

The downside of most of these are they are not foldable and make some compromise with attaching the stove pipe.

[Mr. Red Beard (UKtheBUNNY)]

Tent vs Tarp??? Hammocks all the way. You loose more body heat from the ground and my setup is only about 3Lbs. Thanks for the info on DIY'ing the collapsible stove Andy.

[Andy in NH]

Tent vs Tarp??? Hammocks all the way. You loose more body heat from the ground and my setup is only about 3Lbs.

I'm not sure how cold your winters get, but around here they are cold enough to really challenge a hammock sleeper.

I slept in my Hennessey Hammock during the early fall (and not this weird warm one) and needed extra insulation under me to keep warm. The open space under the hammock really contributes to convection heat loss.

Hammocks are really comfortable to sleep in if you are a back or side sleeper.

The drawback is when you are in a hammock you can't do much in there; cooking, drying gear, and prepping for the next day all become really problematic.

Shamelessly paraphrased from reply #27:

To defeat conductive heat loss while sleeping during the winter, I put a USGI casualty blanket down on the snow to keep the moisture away.  Then I place a USGI closed cell foam mat on top of if.  On top of that I place a DownMat 7 DLX inflatable air mattress.  (I still use the foam pad just in case the inflatable leaks)  I wrap myself in a USGI MSS (the three-bag system) for a bag.  I also keep a USGI poncho-liner inside the bag to protect it from dirt and grime.

For fall / winter, I prefer a Super-Tarp or a Tipi.

I'm glad you enjoyed the stove info.

[Mr. Red Beard (UKtheBUNNY)]

I'm not sure how cold your winters get, but around here they are cold enough to really challenge a hammock sleeper.

I slept in my Hennessey Hammock during the early fall (and not this weird warm one) and needed extra insulation under me to keep warm. The open space under the hammock really contributes to convection heat loss.

Hammocks are really comfortable to sleep in if you are a back or side sleeper.

The drawback is when you are in a hammock you can't do much in there; cooking, drying gear, and prepping for the next day all become really problematic.

The insulation under you compresses and becomes useless. I use a sleeping pad and an underquilt made from a children's sleeping bag. But given the coldest I've slept in is around 17F while snowing. With my extra large tarp I can cook under it and hang gear from the line. I sleep on my side and stomach so I bought a double hammock that allows me to lay how I want.

This is why I didn't go with a package deal like Hennessey while they are nice I have only spent about $80 in my setup. I do plan on making my own snake skins to use with my hammock setup.

On another note how much do one of these stoves weigh?

[Mr. Red Beard (UKtheBUNNY)]

I saw this guy a while back here in Arkansas using a stove with his custom hammock. His setup takes it to another extreme.

[KellyFromRegimentAirsoft]

One pro tip. Link you mitts together with a string, pull string up threw the arm holes and around to the other side. Less likely to loose mitts than way.

If your hiking with snow shoes really take notice on the load limits. The Canadian army tried off the shelf snow shoes rated for 400 pounds, well when you get a 250pd guy and give him 100pds of equipment then get him to run the shoes don't really hold up.
 
Its already been mentioned but sleds really take the load off highly recommended and make sure to bring sunglasses / goggles snow blindness is a real pain in the ass.

One trick from my army days. Not sure if this is a good idea or just because we couldn't have fire at night. Fill a water bottle with snow and place it between you and the inside of your jacket, your body heat will melt the water during the day and you will always have water to drink.

[surfivor]

 I use a rucksack for winter day hikes. It's useful for carrying extra equipment, clothing etc. A rucksack is bigger than a day pack but is not a full size pack and is very useful to have

 I have the LL Bean continental pack and some other type as well

https://www.llbean.com/llb/shop/116656?page=llbean-continental-rucksack

[Alanpandew]

When traveling winter, in addition to clothes, buy a travel bottle that keeps the heat compact and helps store hot water for a long time. Cold water or ice water will quickly lower your body temperature. Always eat hot foods. A little chili, pepper or garlic during meals helps better digestion, increase body temperature and can avoid diarrhea when using other water sources or by eating strange foods.