Armory, Self Defense, And EDC > Black Powder and Primitive Weapons

Are black powder rifles/pistols sustainable?

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joeinwv:

--- Quote from: Carl on September 17, 2014, 05:57:19 PM ---   :jaw-drop:  The QUIGLY...an experimental gun with an experimental ammo ...we're not worthy, we're not worthy

--- End quote ---

Well, I mean you could stop at 45-90, but in for a penny....

Over on greaybeardoutdoors they have a HR forum and some of those guys are doing some very cool stuff. Lots of 357 Maximums - which is a great gun for preppers - can shoot max rounds for hunting, 357 for defense and 38 for practice.

Carl:
I like the idea.

trekker111:

--- Quote from: joeinwv on September 17, 2014, 05:53:52 PM ---Get a NEF / HR 45-70 and then ream it to 45-120 - the extra case capacity will help greatly with blackpowder cartridges. Lots of people do this for silouette shooting. Though at 500+ yards they do have quite a rainbow in trajectory.

Read up on revolutionary war guns - the 70cal smooth bore was fast to load but garbage for accuracy. Rifling is a huge advantage and was a reason armories were major targets - to get rifles.

When you see any renenactors - they will talk about musket accuracy, but in practice can't hit a man sized target at past 50 yards.

--- End quote ---

H&R makes a rifle in 45-70 called the buffalo classic. Long barrel, globe target sights. I have kicked around the idea of cutting the chamber to 45-110, but the nef/ h&rs i have shot have a lot of felt recoil. I wish the buffalo classic barrel was available in the accessory barrel program. There are a few barrels I would have fitted to my topper deluxe. A long barrel for 45-110, preferably, with a scope mount in addition to iron sights. And an 18" 12ga barrel with screw in chokes, both with the intention of shooting mostly bp cartridges in them. I am not concerned about historic authenticity, so I could care less about my long range black powder cartridge rifle having a steel crescent butt plate and case hardened receiver. The stainless receiver of my topper deluxe and a good rubber butt pad suit me just fine.

I would add a 16" 45 colt barrel as well, but I think for the roll that rifle would fill, a Rossi m92 lever action would be a better fit.

The guns I am running bp cartridges in are a marlin 1895g 45-70, a ruger vaquero revolver 45 colt, a H&R topper deluxe in 12ga, and a bond arms Texas defender 410/ 45colt.

I am planning to add a stoeger coach gun supreme 12ga, and a Rossi 92 in 45 colt. Probably both in stainless. I have a few 12ga pumps, but cycling can be hit or miss with the full length brass hulls.

As a side note, while typing the last reply, I remembered that the last shells I shot through my H&R were bp shells, and I can't remember if I had cleaned it since, which is probably 6 months ago. So I went and found it, and it was ugly. The action wouldn't open. I had to hold the button and smack the barrel to get the action to open. A look down the bore made me shudder. It looked like the bore was lined with grey fur, I looked at the muzzle and saw my expensive extra full extended and compensated turkey choke. So I started the hot water in the sink, squirted some dawn in the water, hooked a mop on my cleaning rod, stuck the muzzle in the water then pumped the mop up and down the bore. Wiped everything down with oil and it's good as new.

KeithH:

--- Quote from: mangyhyena on September 09, 2011, 01:32:37 PM ---What I mean is, if civilization permanently fell apart and no more bullets could be manufactured, would you be able to continue using a black powder firearm, even after your supplies for it ran out?  I've read that black powder can be made at home.  Can the other components also be made at home, like the lead ball and wadding?

What is the best black powder rifle in terms of DIY shooting materials, if this can be done?

--- End quote ---
Advantages of a Flintlock Muzzle-loader.
1)   Ammo is less expensive than a modern equivalent caliber firearm.
2)   The smoothbore is very versatile, being able to digest round ball, bird shot, & buckshot, or any combination of two of these (can also use minies/conical slugs).
3)   The fusil is lighter to carry than a modern equivalent sized gun.
4)   You can vary the load if needs be.
5)   The smoothbore will digest other projectiles besides lead.
6)   Lead can be retrieved from downed game & remoulded with a simple mould & lead ladle. This means that you can carry less lead, & more of the lighter gunpowder.
7)   You can make your own gunpowder.
8)   You can use the lock to make fire without using gunpowder.
9)   You can use gunpowder for gunpowder tinder fire lighting if needs be.
10)    IF the lock should malfunction (these are very robust & it is not likely) you can easily repair it if you are carrying a few spare springs & a few simple tools.
11)   If you do not have any spare parts & the lock malfunctions, you can easily convert it to a tinderlock or matchlock & continue using it.
12)   You do not need a reloader, brass shells, caps, or primers. The latter have been known to break down in damp conditions or if they are stored for too long.
13)    Wadding for ball or shot is available from natural plant materials or homemade leather or rawhide.
14)   Less chance of being affected by future ammunition control legislation.
15)   Gunpowder is easily obtainable providing you have a muzzle-loader registered in your name regardless of calibre (NSW).
16)    A .32 caliber flintlock rifle is more powerful than a .22 rimfire, less expensive to feed, more accurate over a greater distance, able to take small & medium sized game, & other than not being able to use shot (unless it is smoothbore), it has all the attributes of the other flintlocks. For larger game you can load with conical slugs, which of course you can make yourself in the field.
17)   Damage from a .62 caliber or .70 caliber pistol or long arm is in the extreme. Wounded prey is unlikely to escape.
18)    By using buck & ball you are unlikely to miss your target. This load is capable of taking out more than one target.
19)    There is less kick-back to a muzzle-loading gun.
20)    Antique Flintlock muzzle-loading guns do not require a license, registration, or a permit to purchase in NSW Australia.

Smoothbores use wads or wading, which is sustainable in a wilderness situation.
Rifles use patches or patch material which is not sustainable in a wilderness situation, but you could use wadding in a rifle with a little loss in accuracy.
Percussion muzzle-loaders are not sustainable.
Flintlocks are sustainable.
In my opinion the smoothbore is far more versatile than a rifle, though you can get smooth rifles.
Keith.


scoop:
Are black powder rifles/pistols sustainable?
Of course they are, take Capt. Kirk for example.
He was able to gather the ingredients for black powder, just look for conspicuous deposits of charcoal, sulfur, and potassium nitrate.  :)

https://youtu.be/IDD3-2_wLR8?t=113

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