The Survival Podcast Forum

Armory, Self Defense, And EDC => Firearms (Including Long Guns, Pistols) => The .22 Caliber Rifle: An Essential Homestead Firearm => Topic started by: ttubravesrock on January 04, 2013, 02:15:36 PM

Title: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: ttubravesrock on January 04, 2013, 02:15:36 PM
I am not a hunter, and I don't shoot at the range often. I have my guns and I keep them cleaned and stored, but over the past 2 years, I have probably put 20 rounds through my Marlin 1890 (.45-70) lever action rifle and 10 rounds through my Weatherby 12 ga. pump action shotgun.

My question is more related to the rifle.

I only have these guns for the purpose of bear, moose, and wolf protection while camping. The shotgun is for my wife to carry and the rifle is for me to carry. I realize that a handgun may be a more popular option for hiking, but we are more comfortable with long barreled weapons for now.

I realize I'm rambling so I'll get to the point.

I want a durable lever action .22 rifle that can kinda-sorta mimic using the .45-70.  Obviously, the ballistics, kick, and power cannot be attained with a .22, but the firing action and feel of the weapon can.  I will never be using the .22 for anything other than target practice.  I want something that is easy to clean and care for.  I want something that will last longer than I will without doing anything more than cleaning it after shooting. I want to know if there is a gun that exists that meets my goals.

I will hang up and take my answer off the air.

Thanks (feel free to critique me, tell me I am wrong, or whatever... I can't be offended)

Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: Veritas on January 05, 2013, 11:24:54 AM
Sorry I can't answer your question about lever actions. However, your intent to use a .22 to train with is a smart idea. I have purchased an M&P22 specifically to do handgun training more economically. I can train more often at a fraction of the cost.

I presume the same would hold with rifle training.
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: Fyrediver on January 05, 2013, 12:29:56 PM
Training with a .22 is a great idea.  The main issues are trigger control and sight alignment and those are perfect issues to train with a .22.  Of course the follow up shots and recoil management won't be accounted for, but if you do well enough with your first shot it shouldn't matter nearly as much.

If you're trying to mimic your rifle then the lever action is a good idea.  However, there will always be differences with manipulation skills.  Remember to step up to the high power rifle once in a while.

I'd also suggest attending an Appleseed, even if you're using a lever action.  There are special accommodations they will make for reloading etc.  This is an excellent, and inexpensive way to learn to shoot.  It's even helped me with my pistol and shotgunning due to the improvement in my trigger control.
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: nelson96 on January 05, 2013, 01:38:51 PM
I don't necessarily agree with your idea, but for a lever action .22 caliber rifle, you can't beat a Henry (http://www.henryrepeating.com/rifle-lever-action.cfm) rifle.  The action isn't identical to your Marlin 1890, but probably as close as you are going to get in a current production rifle. . .  It will most definitely meet your perceived goals.

.
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: Skunkeye on January 06, 2013, 03:05:55 PM
I bought a Henry a couple months back, when I heard they had been hit hard by hurricane Sandy.  I had wanted a lever-action for a while anyway, and figured buying one to help an American gun maker get back on its feet after a disaster was as good a time as any.

Long story short, it's a great little rifle.  The action is incredibly smooth for such an inexpensive gun, and it's plenty accurate for my purposes.  I put a small Williams peep sight on it, which was a big improvement over the stock sights.  Loading won't be the same as your Marlin, since the Henry doesn't have a loading gate, but if you just want to get some practice on the cheap, it'll do the job quite well.  All that said, I will admit I haven't put thousands of rounds through mine or anything, so I can't vouch for the reliability, but most reports from other Henry owners are quite positive in that regard.
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: ttubravesrock on January 17, 2013, 02:47:32 PM
Update:

I took my wife with me and we bought the barebones Henry.  We put about 200 rounds through it and it seemed to work great. It shoots where you point it.  Now we just have to get better at pointing it.  We are fairly accurate to 50 yards without a scope and standing, but I'd like to push that to 150 yards without a scope and standing.

All in all, I'm pretty impressed. We bought it brand new and it is a good gun for under $300 new.

I'd like to look at some scopes and see what kind of difference it makes.
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: Skunkeye on January 17, 2013, 04:21:03 PM
Shoot another 200 rounds through it, and it'll have paid for itself already, compared to shooting 400 rounds of .45-70 through your Marlin.

Be warned, this is the kind of math that can get you into trouble and results in having more .22s than you really need...  ;)
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: flippydidit on January 17, 2013, 09:32:31 PM
Be warned, this is the kind of math that can get you into trouble and results in having more .22s than you really need...  ;)

No such animal.  You can never have too much ammo!  Unless you're swimming or on fire......
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: ADKwarrior on January 24, 2013, 12:09:01 PM
No such animal.  You can never have too much ammo!  Unless you're swimming or on fire......

Agreed!  I use upwards of 1500 rnds on a training weekend between 2 shooters regularly.
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: Canadian Prepper on January 24, 2013, 01:46:46 PM
You'll continue to be happy with the Henry. I was really impressed with the quality of wood on mine, which was rather nice for a $250 rifle at the time.

Though some heavier target .22s can be sighted in for shooting up to 200 yards, the drop off after 100yards is so great that the gun is essentially good for targets within a few yards diffference in range. Some online articles might explain long range .22 shooting in greater detail, which is best done with subsonic ammo (the bullets are thrown somewhate as they drop from sonic to subsonic). .22 LRs are also blown around alot by the wind, but they can be great for 100 yard practice when the weather is calm, especially in the morning and evenings. The latter would be a great way to practice the shooting positions that you'll use in the woods with the heavier 45/70, at pretty close to it's maximum effective hunting/animal defence range.
Title: Re: 22 for training with larger guns
Post by: Carl on September 16, 2016, 09:22:47 AM
The 22 long rifle IS a 50 yard cartridge as most rounds begin to go transonic and de-stabilize at about 75 yards or so...while OK to shoot at 100 yards this instability will cause problems that you can't train out.
I have used the 22 for metallic silhouette ,target,and hunting and learned not to push it beyond 75 yards...though this is farther than most people think.
Practice with crackers at 50 yards and work your way down to aspirin tablets or necco wafers  and you will shoot beyond normal range if needed,practice trigger and breathing till it becomes automatic.

YES , aspirins at 50 yards and postage stamp targets at 75 are possible,but you can train your body at any range...the gun is consistent and knows what to do.Train your body.